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  #21  
Old 06-13-2007, 12:31 AM
return to zion return to zion is offline
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can anyone help me out? I am 21 years old. I was born in Israel and moved to the states when i was almost 8. I have been looking desperately for a volunteer program for ppl in my situation but cannot find one. I dont want to make alliyah but want to serve. Mahal 2000 is for non israelis, i dont have 3 years to give, im getting older by the minute, what options are there for ppl like me who want to serve for about 1-2 years? can anyone help
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  #22  
Old 06-13-2007, 05:36 AM
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Good thread

A few pointers:
1) I served with a Gentile, non-Israeli in an infantry combat unit
2) Mahal volunteers usually serve in combat units of Nahal Brigade, most often 50 Company that also partake in paratroop course and is very combat oriented. At the end of their maslus they are rifleman 07.
3) My#1 was several years ago
4) To return to zion, if you had not registered with your local Israeli Embassy before turning 18, there will be a military warrant for your arrest for not serving your national service in Israel. This can be fixed by coming to Israel, going to the recruitment center where your file is (in the city you were born or last lived in) and thereafter serving your country. You may only need to do 2 years due t your age, but will need to check that at the embassy or in Israel.

Hope that helps someone.

lpr
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  #23  
Old 01-04-2009, 10:43 AM
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Cant someone talk some sense to someone responsible in IDF.

Set up christian english spoken, plattons. People have military experience that they are willing to share with Israel. Even if we are not jewish. All that is needed is some people fluent in both hebrew and english to handle the communication in the bigger organisation.

Training people with experince to a group dont have to take more time than 2 weeks.

Last edited by Orange; 01-04-2009 at 10:47 AM..
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  #24  
Old 01-04-2009, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orange View Post
Cant someone talk some sense to someone responsible in IDF.

Set up christian english spoken, plattons. People have military experience that they are willing to share with Israel. Even if we are not jewish. All that is needed is some people fluent in both hebrew and english to handle the communication in the bigger organisation.

Training people with experince to a group dont have to take more time than 2 weeks.
An enduring challenge for Israel, since it's inception has been the wish of non-citizens to contribute to Israel in ways that are traditionally only allowed to citizens. In other words, there is a strong belief that Israel has a manpower need for it's military. Fortunately this is not the case.

My country has a native language, hebrew, and we expect our citizens to speak it. Oh, you cannot throw a dead cat without striking an english or french speaker, but the language of my country is hebrew. As is our military.

As to allowing anyone who wants to join the military there are some pretty serious international law constraints. There is also a legal question as to Israel recruiting soldiers and the impact this would have on the that persons native citizenship.

Many get insulted when they are pointe to the Sar-El program, as that simply gives you a military experience for a brief period of time, and heck, you can't even shoot anyone. And that is yet another problem that Israel faces almost uniquely. Every single enlistee goes through a psychological screening and vocational test. It has resulted in the lowering of the age of service for non-natives as well as other important changes in determining who is given a machine gun and who is not.

There is an unfortunate element of the world economy that feels when all else fails in the rst of the world and the rest of their life, they can always go to Israel and become a pilot, or a Ranger or some other Special Forces fighter and that will magically repair the rest of their existance.

So in the end, the screening process for non-Israelis wishing to enter the IDF is rather rigorous and results in much much less than 1000 foreigners entering the IDF a year.
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  #25  
Old 01-11-2009, 05:57 PM
mrfong mrfong is offline
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i can understand why israelis do not trust and wishes for their volunteers to be mainly in the support roles. but is there not a better option for all this human effort? give me 100man or woman especially the ones not in shape! or without a good mind! and even handicaps! if allowed, I am sure the volunteers could be more useful in ways other then labor support.

i kind of wanted to be a volunteer but i am above the age limit by a year, the services are limited and confined to traditions formed by conventionalism, and the civilians think volunteers/soldiers are social paths, lacking personal relationships, and only seeking danger and bloodshed. of course all of this is true, why else join but really isn't this just one opinion amongst many generations?

if i were to have what I think of as my 100 mighty men and woman working next to Gaza strip in the towns hardest hit, not only rehabilitating people you "trust" but to heal themselves and conquer their fears, through time such a volunteer "handicapped forces" can do much more than what your bombs/infantry can do in terms of security LONG-TERM. When Hamas is technologically more capable your 100 mighty men with all their senses and all their limbs will lose thier minds and confidence and will learn fear, while my "handicapped" forces were busy preparing and stocking up for all conditions while blind we are used to being handicapped.

when you see that others can be trusted when times are good or bad. and wish for the handicap forces let me know. i don't mind working with ill patients and others whom some see as no potential, i see nothing they regard peace and life greatly. there are more ways to fight and volunteer than just one.
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  #26  
Old 01-12-2009, 02:31 PM
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I am an Israeli bedouin I served in postions I am not allowed to speak about. I knew a dutch christian was in engineer unit with access to very important information about weapon capability. It is possible to attain high place in tzahal but you have to prove yourself. One note I never meet a non israeli pilot. They are the ivy league caliber israelis. That is what make IDF the best, the highest qualified have to serve.
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  #27  
Old 04-23-2010, 06:16 AM
quicksilver quicksilver is offline
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Hey,

I got a question about voluteering in the IDF. I used to work for a half year in a kibbutz in the Galilee region and had some fun time over there. Other than that i went to Israel a couple of times just for holidays and visiting some family. My grandfather was jewish and i got the dutch nationality. Currently i'm living here in Australia doing my Masters. After that, i want to join the IDF for some time. However, i don't wanna clean toilets or making coffee or whatever. I want to do the more serious stuff. Like joining the combat unit and fighting in hostile area. I know this is dangerous and everything, but i just wanna do this. Already for several years but because of school and everything, i never had the time for it. However, currently i'm 26 and therefore above the 23 years age limit for the voluntairy militairy service. Do you guys know any other way how to join the IDF?

Thanks

Michael

Last edited by quicksilver; 04-23-2010 at 06:28 AM..
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  #28  
Old 04-23-2010, 06:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quicksilver View Post
Hey,

I got a question about voluteering in the IDF. I used to work for a half year in a kibbutz in the Galilee region and had some fun time over there. Other than that i went to Israel a couple of times just for holidays and visiting some family. My grandfather was jewish and i got the dutch nationality. Currently i'm living here in Australia doing my Masters. After that, i want to join the IDF for some time. However, i don't wanna clean toilets or making coffee or whatever. I want to do the more serious stuff. Like joining the combat unit and fighting in foreign hostile area. I know this is dangerous and everything, but i just wanna do this. Already for several years but because of school and everything, i never had the time for it. However, currently i'm 26 and therefore above the 23 years age limit for the voluntairy militairy service.
Thanks

Michael
Before Rafi tries to beat (verbally) some sense into you I'll give you an answer: slim to none. Your only chance is to make Aliyah (gain Israeli citizenship), and even than at most you will likely be trained as a reserve rifleman. Of course, in Israel, if you know the right people, beg, and whine enough, you'll be amazed at what you can accomplish. But saying stuff like "I want to go kill me some terrorists", is not something highly looked upon. If you want to serve, serve where you are needed. Many guys come to Israel wanting some action, than run home with their tails between their legs because it wasn't the video game they thought it would be. Your 26, probably older when joining, you really want to be around 18 year olds? Maybe if you have some specialized degree (technical or otherwise) or something of value they'll want you in some unit, but that's doubtful. In any case, Aliyah is your likely only pathway.



By the way, I'm assuming you know Hebrew.

Last edited by HideNSeek; 04-23-2010 at 06:34 AM..
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  #29  
Old 04-25-2010, 07:28 AM
quicksilver quicksilver is offline
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Hey,

I don't think you understand me correctly. I don't want to go there for solely for action but mainly for honour. Running away with your tail between your legs, doesn't fit in there.
Actually now you're talking about it, i can get in contact with an israeli general. Maybe that'll help.

My hebrew is quite limited, im very bad in learning languages and yes i need to improve on that. Thanks for your reply anyway

btw, i don't play video games
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  #30  
Old 04-25-2010, 03:02 PM
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rafi rafi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quicksilver View Post
Hey,

I don't think you understand me correctly. I don't want to go there for solely for action but mainly for honour. Running away with your tail between your legs, doesn't fit in there.
Actually now you're talking about it, i can get in contact with an israeli general. Maybe that'll help.

My hebrew is quite limited, im very bad in learning languages and yes i need to improve on that. Thanks for your reply anyway

btw, i don't play video games

The notorious Rafi here. Look, I want to just give it to people straight. My information sources are pretty good, as I am still in active (reserve) duty in the IDF. So I prefer to tell you like it is. It is stunning the number of people who get off the plane in Israel with a toothbrush and $1.37 and announce "I'm here to kill Arabs!" The IDF has a 1 year residency requirement (sometimes a bit less), a psychological screening, a physical screening, demand for legal documentation of your heritage and a number of other requirements. You can find the exact list here:
http://www.mahal-idf-volunteers.org/...stepbystep.htm
The more items on this list you can complete before leaving home, the successful and easier your time in Israel will be.


As to that whole Hebrew thing. Yes, the IDF does expect people to be able to understand us when we say such things as "You are standing in a mine field", "Do you need more bullets", "help me with our friend who was shot" and so on. If you can't speak Hebrew it makes you the most qualified person on any army base to pick up large heavy objects and carry them to some place else and put them down. For as long as you don't know Hebrew.

I have no first person accounts of anyone over the age of 25 serving in sadir (regular service) since 2004. Lots of anecdotes, lots of "I heard about someone" (usually from the 90s), but not one single "The guys name is, and he served with me here within the past 2 or 3 years".

I really do love the idea of people wanting to serve Israel. But unfortunately it can't be within the parameters you were hoping for.

For deeper documentation regarding age, immigration and length of service, please read the link below.

Rafi


Please click here for a chart of service time in the IDF for specific ages:

http://www.hagshama.org.il/en/resources/view.asp?id=429

Last edited by rafi; 04-26-2010 at 01:33 AM..
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  #31  
Old 04-26-2010, 01:34 AM
WABA WABA is offline
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Rafi, I do appreciate why Israel has such stridgent requirements for any individual to join the Israeli Defence Forces.

The courage and ability of the IDF has done Israel proud and protected Israel's freedom.

However, we live in interesting times for Israel's future, and I believe it could benefit Israel if more thought was given on how to provide for 'non-Israeli' volunteers to join in the defense of Israel.

France has for over a hundred years had an organisation called the 'Frech Foriegn Legion', they basically take fit young men from any nationality, they are combined all in together in to Army units, they don't have to be able to speak French on arrival, but they have the French language taught to them in a very quick and forceful manner.

The language of the 'Foriegn Legion is French, but they also gain be having native speakers from literally dozens of world wide languages as an added benefit.

I think it is fair to say, that the 'French Foriegn Legion' as a fighting unit, has provided France with some of its toughest and best fighting men.

Israel could benefit from a similar fighting Unit.
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  #32  
Old 04-26-2010, 03:03 AM
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Default Yes please.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WABA View Post
Rafi, I do appreciate why Israel has such stridgent requirements for any individual to join the Israeli Defence Forces.

The courage and ability of the IDF has done Israel proud and protected Israel's freedom.

However, we live in interesting times for Israel's future, and I believe it could benefit Israel if more thought was given on how to provide for 'non-Israeli' volunteers to join in the defense of Israel.

France has for over a hundred years had an organisation called the 'Frech Foriegn Legion', they basically take fit young men from any nationality, they are combined all in together in to Army units, they don't have to be able to speak French on arrival, but they have the French language taught to them in a very quick and forceful manner.

The language of the 'Foriegn Legion is French, but they also gain be having native speakers from literally dozens of world wide languages as an added benefit.

I think it is fair to say, that the 'French Foriegn Legion' as a fighting unit, has provided France with some of its toughest and best fighting men.

Israel could benefit from a similar fighting Unit.
And also old, fat men who are good shots.
+1
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  #33  
Old 04-26-2010, 11:37 AM
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And also old, fat men who are good shots.
+1
Well, we already established all the young skinny stupid ones who have never held a weapon before are trying to get into the IDF. So the rest have to go somewhere. And best of all, they don't require someone knowing how to speak their language!


http://www.legion-recrute.com/en/

  1. Can I join the Legion never having been a soldier before ?Yes. Even if many Foreign Legion candidates have previous military experience, this is not an essential requirement. Our basic training teaches all legionnaires enough military know-how to be able to serve with “honour and fidelity”. Previous knowledge of the French language is not required either. French is taught to legionnaires during basic training.
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  #34  
Old 04-27-2010, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by rafi View Post
Well, we already established all the young skinny stupid ones who have never held a weapon before are trying to get into the IDF. So the rest have to go somewhere. And best of all, they don't require someone knowing how to speak their language!
Oh Yeah! Not trying to argue, just want to point out that what we mean is that WHEN THE DEAL GOES DOWN you may need more bodies.

As for Babel, there are are more Israelis fluent in English than there are English fluent in Israeli. There is always a good work around. I for one really would enjoy coming there at my own expense, and be able to absorb the language at my own senile pace, enjoy the comraderie, and share my skills. Don't discriminate the aged, just the selection of spots for the infirm: someone had to hold up Moshe's hand during his late battles with Amelik.

I would give my incisors to be able to come over and help train the skinney and the stupid in surgical shooting, or to help in a military machine shop. Being able to do both would put me into a higher ecstasy than the Chasidim can find.

Just saying: We are there for you when you need us and want us, and
One hand washes the other. C'mon Sgt Cav!
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  #35  
Old 04-28-2010, 03:56 AM
WABA WABA is offline
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Actually when push comes to shove, and on the ground front line fighters are needed, it has aways seemed to me, that to send the finest and best of our youth on to front lines, is an oxymoron.

We need them, to first have, then raise the next generation, and more important pay taxes to suport us golden oldies in our dotage.LOL

In reality the loss of and 'older' citizen is much less of an impact on a country than a 'younger' citizen.

Plus it would save a fortune in not having to pay out old age pensions.

Plus cranky old people can really fire up when anyone messes with them. LOL

I must admit you actually don't get any smarter as you grow older, but you do get more cunning, and 'age and cunning' will beat 'youth and inexperience' any time.

Plus being frugal golden oldies, ( waste not want not ), the rate we shoot at we would save the Army a small fortune in ammunition.

Last edited by WABA; 04-28-2010 at 04:01 AM..
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  #36  
Old 04-28-2010, 05:45 AM
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I'll take the point.
At the very least, I should be good for drawing fire. lool
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Last edited by TwoStrike; 04-28-2010 at 05:46 AM.. Reason: incomplete
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  #37  
Old 04-29-2010, 06:22 PM
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Not to mention that we are stingy enuf to make our own ammo, but that's ok
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  #38  
Old 06-20-2010, 03:56 PM
Slaro Slaro is offline
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When you are 23 (i'm 21) joining is still possible i guess (for non-Israeli) ?
The border is your birthday when you become 24 or is it something else ?
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  #39  
Old 07-31-2010, 07:54 PM
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Shalom!

Ok i have this question for you, I am a qualified person with 20+ years of experience in a specialized skill set. That makes me old but experienced? I have allot of military & police training. I have been in combat & have had to defend myself. (Yes in South Africa) I am also actively involved in training younger people in my specialized trade. I would give the proverbial left ... to serve Israel & like Twostrike says I can shoot reel good if need be! My skills are not really front line stuff but help the gears turn so to speak. What would my chances be to get a job in the IDF?
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  #40  
Old 08-01-2010, 02:01 AM
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Shalom!

Ok i have this question for you, I am a qualified person with 20+ years of experience in a specialized skill set. That makes me old but experienced? I have allot of military & police training. I have been in combat & have had to defend myself. (Yes in South Africa) I am also actively involved in training younger people in my specialized trade. I would give the proverbial left ... to serve Israel & like Twostrike says I can shoot reel good if need be! My skills are not really front line stuff but help the gears turn so to speak.

What would my chances be to get a job in the IDF?
Without the sunshine traditionally blown up people's, um, noses - none what-so-ever. I could write flowery paragraphs if you so desire, but that is the reality.
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