Merkava vs M1 Abrams

[[MakkabI]]

Which tanks Merkava or M1 Abrams are better and powerful???

[HideNSeek]

Originally Posted by [MakkabI]

Which tanks Merkava or M1 Abrams are better and powerful???

Abrams is a great tank, but a) its twice as expensive as Merkava b) not great in the Golan, I think an Abrams was tried there, and its track broke off.

[[MakkabI]]

So, Egypt have these Abrams and Israel dont?

so what if theres a MBT war between Israel and Egypt? Egypts gonna win coz of Abrams!?

[[MakkabI]]

and do Israel have any Abrams? if so, how many? like 100?

[¿¿¿]

Israel has a better air force

[[MakkabI]]

Yeh I know but still I think Israel should have some M1 Abrams... to make Israel more stronger!

[kryp]

there is no reason to buy abrams after we spent a lot of money to develop the amazing merkava 4. its better tank for us and we are going to buy more. the merkava 3 is also very good and can fight very well against abrams.

[HideNSeek]

Originally Posted by [MakkabI]

So, Egypt have these Abrams and Israel dont?

so what if theres a MBT war between Israel and Egypt? Egypts gonna win coz of Abrams!?

Well...first of all, Egypt has a downgraded version of the Abrams. Secondly, the Merkava, Abrams (the American version), Leopard, Leclerc etc, are all excellent MBT's. The Merkava is just developed with the Israeli terrain in mind...unlike the Abrams.

The US pushed Israel to buy it...but Israel turned them down...we'll see what the future holds.

[[MakkabI]]

how many do Israel have MK4?

[[MakkabI]]

and what are they gonna to do with old MK 1 and 2?

[Topmaul]

This vs That you have to take in to consideration the quality of the crew and supporting eliments. Not simply the tank, some one said M1 was not effective in the Golan, Egypt will not be fighting in the Golan and if they do Israel will have big problems!

[[MakkabI]]

what about in Sinai?

[BrittleSteel]

From what I understand the Abrams is a bit better in desert, but the merkava was designed with that in mind as well (including Israeli tank training).

The Merkava is a fine tank which the greatest protected and a number of novelties. Its difficult to really say which tank is better because each was designed for the countries needs in mind.

I don't have a problem having a Merkava 3 or 4 face an Egyptian Abrams, or even a modern one.

The merkava 1 have been phased out. The 1's are pretty much gone are i heard some are being sold.

There was talk of using the hull of the Mk 1's for the new Israeli APC, Namera. But they later opted for using new hulls from the merkava 4's design.

The mkerkava 2 is still in service, but many beleive it is slowly being phased out as new merkava 4's roll off the assembly line.

One reason, among many, that it is beneficial for Israel to stick with the Merkava, and not with the abrams, is that the Merkava is locally produced. So Israel does not has such a large dependence on foreign countries for part parts for building and maintaining their tank force. Also the Merkava program has been a huge economic boost to Israels tech industry.

[Topmaul]

The problem with the M-1 is fuel consumption and that huge infra-red signature.

[kryp]

Originally Posted by [MakkabI]

how many do Israel have MK4?

no one knows. probably not more than 400. but the army is going to buy more hundreds.

[TankHunter]

Originally Posted by [MakkabI]

So, Egypt have these Abrams and Israel dont?

so what if theres a MBT war between Israel and Egypt? Egypts gonna win coz of Abrams!?

The Egyptian Abrams have steel armor rather than the composite armor IIRC and uses one of the KEWA (KEWA-1 IIRC) ammunition types (don't feel like looking up the performance of them) but assuming that Israel and Egypt go at it like the good old days, then the Abrams would likely be the inferior tank. If the later model Merkavas are armored anything like the Leopard 2A5 or better, then the KEWA will have difficulty penetrating the Merkavas frontally at 1-2 K and beyond. If the Merks are anything like the STRV122 when it comes to armor, then even top of the line ammunition that the US Army uses would have difficulty penetrating frontally at 1K.

If you want expert advice, go to tank-net.org for better replies on the subject.

[arham]

Originally Posted by [MakkabI]

Yeh I know but still I think Israel should have some M1 Abrams... to make Israel more stronger!

the M1A2 is not invincible anymore.iraq is a prime example.the type-99 tanks which the chinese r exporting to north-african countries r nowbetter than the M1A2 in every sense

[HideNSeek]

Originally Posted by arham

the M1A2 is not invincible anymore.iraq is a prime example.the type-99 tanks which the chinese r exporting to north-african countries r nowbetter than the M1A2 in every sense

I doubt that as the Chinese like copy Russian (or some other nations) hardware (look at their planes, heck the J-10 even looks like a modified Lavi, and their best planes are SU's).And to be better "in every sense", it actually needs to go through some sort of combat...until that day its just another tank yet to be proven.

Oh yeah, and what about Iraq? It's not like the Abrams is being blown up everyday. No tank is invincible, and the Abrams is better than most, along with the Challanger, Leopard, Merkava, etc.

[Hits]

thank you

[shelory]

has there bin any M1s casualties do to tank vs tank battles? cos i know there where some that where distroyed\taken out\flipped by massive IED's (1+ tun)